The Outdoor Gibbon
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The Outdoor Gibbon
78 A Scotland Stalking Weekend With Hunter Gatherer Cooking
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Two months of silence can look like a content gap from the outside, but sometimes it’s just life hitting hard. I open with a personal update on why the Outdoor Giving Podcast went quiet, then pivot back to what we do best: honest conversations from the field that show the reality of hunting, deer management, and countryside work without the polished fantasy.
From a kitchen table in Aberdeenshire, I’m joined by Alex from Hunter Gatherer Cooking to unpack his Scotland trip and the bigger “why” behind the Estates Collective films. We talk about coming into deer stalking as a novice, the shock of that first real moment, and why responsible hunters don’t chase the kill, they chase a clean, ethical outcome and a freezer full of food. If you’ve ever wondered what mentorship really looks like, or why experienced stalkers still treat every decision with caution, you’ll feel seen here.
We also get practical on education and progression, including PDS1 versus DSC1, learning styles, and why structured training early can save years of confusion. Then we head into modern night shooting in Scotland: thermal imaging, night licenses, target identification, and the uncomfortable truth that tech can increase the room for error if you don’t practice with discipline. Add in a bit of range work, mink trapping, and pheasant checks, and you’ve got a proper snapshot of real-world field sports.
Subscribe for more grounded hunting and conservation stories, share this with a mate who’s curious about deer stalking, and leave a review so more listeners can find the show. What part of this conversation do you want us to go deeper on next?
A Hard Personal Update
SPEAKER_02Hello and welcome to another episode of the Outdoor Giving Podcast. I'm going to first off apologize. It's been a bit silent for probably the last two months, but let me give you a bit of an update on to why and what's been going on. So I think I've alluded to obviously issues and things family related, but we'll just give you all the fill-in. I lost my mum back in December, and I have been running around the country sorting things out, sorting out my stepfather and all the rest of it. And as you can imagine, it uh it eats up quite a lot of time. And unfortunately, I've been doing the recordings, but actually finding the time to sit down and get something edited has taken has taken its toll. I'm currently sat in a hotel room in Lithuania. I've got a few hours before I get on with Pulsar, and we start uh doing this sort of our usual Pulsar Pro staff meeting, and I thought, you know what? I'm actually gonna spend that time and I'm gonna get something edited. I uh used a few hours at the airport yesterday to um clean up some audio from another recording, and today I thought I'll dig back and see what we've got. And we've got a very short episode here that was recorded back in October of all things with Alex from Hunter Gatherer Cooking, and we're gonna let you have a listen to that. A bit of a sort of a breakdown of his trip to Scotland. So let's look at where we are in the year. Well, it's May. I don't know quite how we got to May. The last time I was looking at something, I was just coming back from the stalking show, and I think we should touch on that. The 2026 stalking show this year at Stafford was possibly the best show that I've been to. It was Manic. Saturday was probably the busiest day ever. There was getting around the getting around the show area was hard work. There were just so many people. Thank you to every one of you who listens to this podcast who made the effort to actually come and find me, say hello, say what you enjoy about the show, give feedback and other items that you you raised. It is so valuable to have those conversations. And it does doesn't matter that you actually met me in person, it's the people that reach out on the social media via the email and stuff like that. I'm absolutely touched every time somebody sends me a message. Please keep doing it. If there's anything you want on the show, feedback, etc. etc., please do. It's it's so valuable to be able to create content for you guys that you enjoy listening to. But as I say, the stalking show of 2026 was phenomenal, absolutely brilliant. We have got loads of recordings from the British Deer Society soundstage. So any of the chats that went on during the weekend, they have all been recorded. They're going to take a bit of time to edit and get sorted, and then hopefully we can get some of those out for you to listen to. So if there was a particular talk that you wanted to know about, maybe for example, the head shooting talk or uh something to do with the use of night vision or thermal technology about night shooting, they will come out in due course. I've still got a load of stuff that I actually recorded previously at the Scottish Game Fair of last year to release as well. So we've got plenty of content to come, so don't worry that there has been this slight gap in service, but you just hold hold on and uh it'll all be coming out. There are some fantastic talks and some fantastic interviews that uh we've got to bring to you. But as I said, the stalking show this year was phenomenal. Just catching up with everybody, seeing everything that's going on there, talking to all the the stall holders. I think everybody had a good time. I'm not sure there was any major headaches. It uh it just goes, yeah, it's definitely a it could be a three-day show next year. There was some talk about that again, but at the moment they've released the 2027 dates as again just a two-day show. How's everything else going? Well, we're well and truly into the roebux season. I've not been out shooting that much, obviously, due to other things and time, but the the roebux seem to be going on quite nicely. We're just starting to see that transition now with the deer getting their summer coats. So if you shoot something now, it is literally it's fluff and fur everywhere, but they will soon look very bonny in their bright orange jackets. What else is happening in the world? Well, the pheasant rearing has started egg production. I think the first chicks we've we've had put on the field already. I know last week or the week before, I was out gassing up uh all the pheasant sheds and and doing stuff like that. So it's it's speeding along. The weather's been keeping pretty good, to be honest. Still a bit cold. I think the other morning I was driving down the uh the main road looking over towards the care gorgeous, and there was snow on the tops. Not unusual for May, but still those four degrees in the mornings, it's still a bit nippy and uh getting yourself out, and and all of a sudden the temperature's warming up to 16, 17 degrees. Well, looking out the window from my hotel room, it is a bonny day here, and I mean it is beautiful. Blue skies, it's not a not the best for you. I'm just looking at the other side of the hotel. But I can see the sky and the sun is shining, and our chat group is going absolutely wild, so it means all the other pro staff are on their way at airports, catching flights. It's gonna be gonna be a good good visit. I will be trying to document some of that. So, watch this space in the near future for another podcast, maybe a bit of an insight view as to a pro staff meeting and a little bit of fun and some of the chats with different people that we generally can't pin down to try and get those recordings and those chats. So uh yeah, there may be a few after a few beers, and you never know. We might have some some classic content. Watch this space and uh I'll bring you forward. The podcast will keep going forward. We've got plenty lined up in the pipeline, and the next big show for me will be the Scottish Game Fair. So let's get on and have a listen to this little recording I did with Alex back in October 25. Sat in my kitchen after a busy weekend. The Outdoor Given Podcast is proudly sponsored by the Shooting and Hunting Academy, an online training platform and UK registered learning provider that provides a host of accredited and nationally available courses and masterclasses delivered by leading industry experts.
Rachel @#StileHi guys, it's Rachel here from Style, the new social app for field sports and farming. Join our countryside community on the App Store or Google Play. Just search Style Country. Enjoy the show.
SPEAKER_02We are sat in a kitchen, my kitchen actually, in Aberdeenshire, looking out the window. It's a bit of a bluey grey sky. It was raining this morning, but I am joined by the one, the only Alex from the Hunter Gatherer Cooking, and we've had a bit of a busy weekend uh stalking, all sorts of stuff, looking at pheasants, um mink traps, and everything that goes with my life up in Scotland. So it's all coming as a film in the future.
SPEAKER_01How are you doing? I'm good, mate. We've had a fantastic weekend, haven't we? I've just sat here looking through all the pictures just in case you ask me any questions and I can't remember what we've done over the last two days. Well, I suppose we'll go right back to the beginning.
SPEAKER_02And um what's that, three almost four years ago, I think we met at the stalking show. And then from there, I think you've been up to Scotland what? Oh my god. Four times? Three times?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, to see you. We've done two snow. We've done two snow, we didn't tag, yeah. First year. Oh that's yeah. Three, four. It's at least four.
SPEAKER_02It's at least four times. So this this might be your fifth visit, and um this time it was a bit more trying to get more stuff covered, I think, really. We we wanted to go through uh make a decent film, uh, because you may well have seen on Alex's uh social feed something called the Estates Collective, which is a bunch of like-minded people from all parts of the UK, and I think you're you're showcasing them at the moment.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I mean it was it started off just as a WhatsApp group for you know some mentor people that decided to help me, and then I decided, well, let's get them featured on my channels in a structured-ish kind of way, and all of a sudden we're making films together, and I'm out with Stuart and Sarah and James and and now you, and I think it's working quite well, really. I think people enjoy seeing the diversity, not only of the people, but also the land and the stalking styles and the food and things like that.
SPEAKER_02No, absolutely, and I think that's the whole thing. It's kind of it brings the whole bigger picture to the table, doesn't it? And people can sit there and and kind of join us on the adventure. To the table. It's good, isn't it? Yeah. Very clever. You see that? Very clever. Quick on my pans. I've been uh been the comedy moments for for Alex all weekend.
SPEAKER_01For those who don't know Peter as well as I know him, he is a fantastic animal speaking comedian. All he does all day is talk on behalf of the dogs, the cats, any animal that's in a field as you drive by, he does voices, stories, and characters.
SPEAKER_02So yeah, we are sat in the kitchen at the moment with three spaniels that may well bark if somebody knocks on the door. Um, but yeah, as Alex says, there's been running commentary of the dogs during the day uh while they're causing chaos and jumping up and down at the table and stuff like that.
SPEAKER_01Have you done many podcasts from here?
SPEAKER_02Have you done any? I've I've only ever done one other from a kitchen table, uh, and that was it hasn't come out yet. That will be with Farmer Jim. Uh uh yeah, we did that in his kitchen down in Perthshire.
SPEAKER_01It's very fun.
SPEAKER_02Oh, it's good, isn't it? Because you can have a cup of tea. We're relaxed, we're happy. We've still got the work laptop open, yeah. Busy, busy checking it, because obviously Alex shouldn't be here on this Monday morning. But the flight got cancelled. So we we ended up with a bit of a bonus, uh sort of a bit of extra time and all the rest of it. So it's been actually really nice to finally we've spoken about doing a recording so often, but uh we always run out of time. We do.
SPEAKER_01So we met four odd years ago.
SPEAKER_02Four odd years ago and invited him up to come and film some grouse, I think was the key.
SPEAKER_01Well, that's not how it started for me. You were the first person that actually took the time to start explaining calibres and things like that to me.
SPEAKER_02Well, I think you looked like a rabbit in the headlights with people just talking technical facts.
SPEAKER_01Well, I I felt like a runover rabbit in headlights on the side of the road that had been there for weeks.
SPEAKER_02I think we were standing on a stand and you were looking at what was it? It was some they weren't proof, they were another manufacturer's rifle. Yeah. Um, and you just it the guy was witch talking to you about the the chassis it was built on and all the rest of it.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, because at the time I would think I wouldn't I have my application in, and it was like, well, I could get a gun. Yes, but it won't be yet, and then he uh uh ultimately was trying to sell me one and why it was so great and it was you you just like uh yeah, okay, like starry-eyed.
SPEAKER_02So does it go bang? Yeah, pretty much so um yeah, and it went from there, we chatted, and and that was that, and then it obviously it's taken off as as people will have seen. If they go to your YouTube page, you came up here, we did the we did the grouse, we've done your first ever first ever first ever deer, actually. Um, as you call him Nigel. Uh, you scoped yourself with my rifle. Uh-huh. Uh you twisted your ankle, dragging him off the battle. Uh you what else have we done? And then you came back and I beasted you round the hill in the snow. That hurt. There's a theme here. And then you came back again, and then we shot a nice hind in the snow. That didn't hurt so much.
SPEAKER_01That was quite a steady day. Well, it did it did hurt because I was chasing you round the hills. Um, Tom was the other side, wasn't he? And I was trying to keep up with you. Well, that was the first snow. Second snow was No, the second snow was the bumsliding, wasn't it?
SPEAKER_02No, that was first snow. Was it? Yeah.
SPEAKER_01What did we do on the second one?
SPEAKER_02Second snow, we walked up to the back of Balnaboth, and uh that's when you had your own rifle.
SPEAKER_01Oh course, and then we yeah, we shot the very, very well, we thought I'd missed basically.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, we shot a good good hind, and uh that was a quite a relaxed, relaxed day. That was on my birthday. I took you out. Yeah, because I was your birthday present. Exactly. Yeah, there we go. So lucky. I know, it's amazing. And uh and then we sat out in minus seven, we cooked some meat, and that was good in an old Land Rover. Yeah, and then you're back again this time. It's more of a an autumnal feeling. Uh the the weather has been now. Yeah, it's been uh it's been actually really good weather. We've had we've had some some great stuff, and in this sort of this visit, you've we've we went stalking on some clear film and got some nice footage up there. Well, I left my coat back in Bristol, so it really needed to be good weather. 100%. And then uh we actually touched on a subject that many won't see, which was a bit of night shooting and under license. Yeah. Uh then we've had a But that was fun.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_02And there's really that was new to me. Yeah. And we've uh we had a final little start yesterday, which was probably what maximum 20 minutes.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, in terms of shooting, uh it might have been a bit longer to be fair. Like once we went because we then walked up the hill. There was a there was a yeah, it's probably 20 minutes, half hour in total, but and we were on to them within two minutes.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, saw them, moved in, it moved, it went down, it came up, bang, it fell over. It probably took longer to drag it out and carry it out.
Mentorship And The Emotional Reality
SPEAKER_01So by the time this comes out, hopefully there's a film that says something like the Estate Collective episode for Pete Gibbon and the Roebuck Burgers. Exactly. Hopefully.
SPEAKER_02So let's let's have a look at your journey. So you're completely new, I should say.
SPEAKER_01Well, you're four years in now, completely new. I still feel new, yeah. I can hold a conversation, but I would never ever ever profess to know anything.
SPEAKER_02But how has that journey been for a complete novice coming into the shooting industry?
SPEAKER_01Um I got lucky because I found you guys, which I'm not just saying that, but sometimes you can fall into the wrong clo crowd. But you guys have always supported me, you've not taken the mick too much. Um actually you have, but it's helped. But it's no one's pushed me to do anything that I wasn't comfortable with. Right. Um I just shot a it's probably not gonna end up as a new film, it'll end up as something. But we took a complete novice out recently, on Thursday actually, just before it came out. And um it was interesting to see all those new reactions, all the fresh reactions of someone who doesn't have a clue, and my god, I could remember it.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_01Um but it was also brilliant to see those reactions. Um, there's something very real about shooting, and we were talking in the car on the way up, and you know, he was excited and looking forward to it, but he hadn't ever fired a rifle. Okay. Um the first rifle I fired was with you. In fact, the third round that I had ever fired was into Nigel. He didn't tell me that on the day.
SPEAKER_02I did, I literally said, I don't know what I'm doing, yeah. But it just goes to show, but with the right mentorship, you've obviously followed Matt around for such a long time.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I mean, at that point I was two years in to following and watching. Yep, and that's what got me was the curiosity. Once I went on the first one, I was like, what the you know, in a good way. I was really put off the first five minutes after the first shot. I thought, I can't do this, I don't want to do this, should I be vegan? You know, it was it got real, real, real, yeah, real quick, real quick. And it was like, well, we've just killed an animal. I I do not feel good about that, and actually that's one of my pet hates because when people say you're just a bunch of hunters, you enjoy killing things, I take no pleasure in killing anything, absolutely no pleasure in that whatsoever. And people don't know or they forget that the the shooting part is a split second in a five, ten-hour day, and they don't appreciate the skill that goes into it, the time, the patience, the learning weeks, months before the preparation of the trip, the conversations, none of that gets taken into account. It's always you enjoy killing animals, and it's not the case, and that's what I want to use my channel for is to try and show the what I would say the reality is, as to it's not a bunch of guys just going off into the wilderness trying to kill things. Yeah, one, the end result for me is that it goes in the chiller or the freezer and we eat it, we make some fantastic food because everyone likes food and eating. Um, and then the other part is trying to educate people on why we do it, how we do it, and the structure behind it. Yeah, you know, whether the days in season or whether there's a coal plan and things like that, nothing gets wasted and everything, everything can be used.
SPEAKER_02I think that's the really important part, and I think that's where having the reach and your channel is is not a hunting channel, it is a food channel, and you're probably showing more and more people more stuff about it. Which is it is leaning that way now, though. Yeah, okay, maybe a little bit. Well, it's had to. Yeah, 100%. But I think the the the main thing is it's really nice to have seen somebody coming on the journey, which we don't often get to see because a lot of people aren't willing to put them themselves out there.
SPEAKER_01Well, I've put the the good bits and the bad bits, yeah. And again, it's another thing that I mean I had quite a bit of sec scrutiny with the gut-shot deer. There was a few people who didn't like it, it was actually generally positively received, which was good. But when I hit the obviously you upload it and then you've got that make it live button. Yeah, yeah. I was apprehensive. I was thinking, My god, I am opening the floodgates here.
SPEAKER_02But as you've seen this weekend, things, even seasoned shooters, stuff goes wrong. Yeah, and and it's how you deal with it and how you respond to it, makes a huge difference.
SPEAKER_01Well, I was lucky because again, to give James a big shout out, I was very lucky because I wasn't on my own in that situation. I had someone to lean on and ask for help and to guide me through this horrible process, basically.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, and it and it isn't it isn't a nice process being being the witness to it and seeing it. We I think I think anybody that actually takes pride in what they do and is a is a proper hunter is very much animal welfare over anything else. 100%.
SPEAKER_01But the the the last thing I ever wanted was to injure a deer. Yeah. The best thing that could happen, like yesterday, boom, straight on the ground. Done. That's that's that's the goal for me. But again, James didn't um he didn't wade in. I mean he stood by and watched and laughed at me whilst I was going through it, but he made me learn.
SPEAKER_02But it's the learning curve you get from that, is the the stuff you've learned from that will be valuable going forward should it happen again.
Training Paths PDS1 Vs DSC1
SPEAKER_01And you find out in those moments what you don't know. Yeah, yeah, 100%. You don't know what you don't know until it's right in front of you.
SPEAKER_02And then it you've got to think back. You've obviously been on the route of education, and I think you're uh unusual for some people because you've gone down both routes, the PDS one and you're doing the uh the DSC one at the same time. Do you want to just sort of give a little overview of of what you think of both of those?
SPEAKER_01Um yeah, so ultimately it's Oxford or Cambridge. Um they're deemed to be the same level of qualification by is it Lantra and things like that? It's all been signed.
SPEAKER_02One's Lantra approved and the others just Yeah.
SPEAKER_01But you know, they're deemed to be the same dear qualification. The the main difference at the time when I did PDS one is it was pretty much at the time it was the only online course that was available. So um BDS um through DSE1 now do the online course, but it was the only online course that you could sit down and learn in the comfort of your own home. Now the world has moved on completely in in education now. You can pretty much sign up to any course now for anything you could imagine, probably, and do some kind of e learning. And you know, Peter Jones and the team actually did really, really well to put that course together. Everything that I said on the review video, I absolutely meant it. It was uh it was very comprehensive, it was engaging. Um, visually, it it looked good, and I bought into it. There was a bit of gamification where you were breaking down the chapters and you did the quizzes before obviously you got to the end, so you you felt good about it or not, depending if you failed that chapter. But it did make me want to keep going and going and going. I'd sit down one night and say, Oh, I'm only going to do one chapter, and you'd sit there and do three. And then at the time, compare that to the BDS Bible that comes through, you know, this massive uh ring-bound folder of pages and pages and pages of words and photos that you don't really know what's going on. And when you get into the legislation um and the ballistics and things like that, I mean, for me, that is a nightmare. Yeah, I'm not um I'm not uh diagnosed as dyslexic or anything like that, but I struggle to learn in that way. The best way I can learn is through experience or videos, probably as a number two. So I need to watch something to to take it in. And at the time that was it. So BDS have caught up with that now. They now offer the online course. You still need to do the shooting assessment of both courses and the examination, isn't it?
SPEAKER_02Actually, under test conditions.
SPEAKER_01Uh yeah, so you basically you e-learn at home and then you go in for the assessment and then you uh for the theory assessment, yeah, and then you do your shooting assessment with them as well.
SPEAKER_02So that's the that's the DSC one, either offered by B Basque, uh British Day Society, etc. That's all the same. So that bit, yeah, you still got to physically turn up in person, whereas the PDS one you came up to Scotland and I put you through a vigorous PDS one shooting test.
SPEAKER_01I deeply regretted that day.
SPEAKER_02But it was again, it was going through that whole process. Uh I knew who you were, but I was still going to make you Well, you failed me.
SPEAKER_01I failed, exactly. Yeah, I made a tragic mistake of trying to save a few quid by using some rounds that I just wanted to get rid of, not really thinking how bad they were, which is why I wasn't using them.
SPEAKER_02Yep, and there you go. That and but it's a really good learning curve that you you'll take away from that. You can't just go, well, I'll just use these up and get rid of them. Yeah. So that's good. So are you signed up to go further now that you've shot? Well, you've shot a few, what's that? I think you said to me the other day, is it 12 deer? 12 deer.
SPEAKER_01So I'm up to 12, up to L for Leon. They're all named. They're all named, yeah. But I mean, I don't care. People rip it out of me, but I can I can I know when I go to the freezer, so I label them up with um uh with the name, with the species, uh, and a date and a cut, if it's not really, really obvious. But I know, like the other day we got we got some of Nigel out the freezer for some um for pulled venison, and I saw Nigel on there. Well, I knew I knew it was yours because of the green writing, but it brought back where I was, who I was with, the weather, the 12 and a half minutes that I lay there to get that shot right, how relaxed I felt, the last thing that you said, you don't have to do this if you don't want to. Do you want to? You said fire when ready, and the trigger was pulled. I you know, I can recall that instantly just by saying Nigel.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_01No, and that's why I do it. And I'm not like you guys, I don't shoot loads and loads of deer. I've got no need for that as such. But all the deer I shoot, I want to put in the freezer and then create more stories in the culinary side of it.
SPEAKER_02No, 100%. But do you think you're gonna carry on and get a level two, either a PDS two or a DSC2?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, definitely want to do that. I'm doing some stuff with BDS at the moment, so there will hopefully, if it all goes well, there will be two new films by the end of the year. One all about why we manage deer and how we do it, and then two, I don't know what I'm gonna call it, but like the joys of venison, basically. So all about venison, how good it is, and then some options around it. And then after that, I will next year be doing some more learning with them to help them put some stuff together, and then I will push myself to eventually get the the second stage. I don't need to do that, I want to do that, but I think it's really important to to have that.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, because obviously the the the level one is more of an introduction to deer stalking, it hasn't really given you any it's given you all the fundamentals.
SPEAKER_01If if you guys had made me, if you said, right, we're not even talking to you until you do this, it would have sped up my learning so much more. Okay. Like so much more. If if you know, if if I'd done that, so if there was any advice for anyone who was looking to get into shooting with zero or next to zero experience, I would actually say if if you're serious, fork out the money for either course and just do it, because actually it will open your eyes to it and you will have a very, very, very basic understanding of what is to come.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I think I think the next part after that really is try and then find somebody that will take you out and give but not just one person, it's multiple people, so you can see different ways because we were grolicking a deer yesterday, and I said, I bet you others do it differently to the way I'm doing it.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. I've and that's and I I really enjoy that, but even to I've I've said this a number of times, even to the point of the way you all walk, because I'm behind you filming, so all I get to see is your ass, yeah, and your and your footsteps and things like that, and you've all got a different walk. Some will be super casual, like super casual, like a walk in the park, and then others, it's all for them, it's all about foot placement and staying silent. And when I break a twig, you look back and stare at me.
SPEAKER_02Or you look back, and Alex is like still 30 yards behind, and you think this deer's gonna see us in a minute, taking a picture of a mushroom or something, yeah. Exactly.
SPEAKER_01Which happened multiple times this weekend. I don't get to see mushrooms very often, so that was new.
Hunting Culture Abroad And Food Focus
SPEAKER_02But I think that's the thing, because you stalk with people, let's just say up and down the country, you see all these different characters, every species of deer has a different method for the stalk. It's like when we're out on the hill, we cover ground, we just walk until that that final approach when everything goes into like right, silence, get down, crawl. Yeah, but when we're stalking row, it's a whole nother thing altogether. It's it's move a little, look a lot kind of thing. Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_01Can we talk non-deer? Yeah. Because I just came back from Norway. Okay, and that was cool. Yeah. So Moose Film not yet out, but it will be by the time this comes out.
SPEAKER_02The Outdoor Gibbon Podcast is proudly sponsored by the Shooting and Hunting Academy. Through the Academy, shooters, hunters, and those involved in the use of firearms can gain an in-depth and unique level of training that enables them to shoot better, behave more effectively in the field, up their strike rates, as well as learning new skills. Crucially, those new to deer stalking, the Academy also offers the Proficient Deer Stalker Certificate Level 1, the PDS 1, a deer management certificate that is nationally recognized and accredited both by Lantra and UK rural skills. Visit the Shooting and Hunting Academy to find out more. Let's get back to the show.
SPEAKER_01And that's that's something on the education side I want to push. So it's it's always going to be UK deer stalking because obviously that's that's where I live. Yeah. But through speaking to um the guys over in Norway, I mean it's completely different. Well, it's the same, but their regulation and the way that they do it is completely different, and I find that fascinating. So coming back from a moose hunt, you know, learn almost a completely different way, a different way of life, and even the culture of the country, they regard hunters completely different to over here. You know, we we have to watch what we say, we look in the shadows, you know, it's a taboo generally. I I mean, um, whereas in other countries it's um embraced and loved and respected. Um, the education side of it, the the structure behind the learning, things like that, completely different. So Norway taught me that. I'm hoping Croatia is going to teach me some more lessons when I get over um there at some point. And then I'd love to push the channel as far as I can, I'd love to take it to the States where possible, um, and then just see how people are doing it. If it's for food, I'm really happy. I mean, I've got no interest in you know the whole lions and things like that. That doesn't interest me at all. Um, but there are some stories within that that I wouldn't mind learning about. Yeah, no, absolutely. Um, but anything I shoot, I absolutely want to eat.
SPEAKER_02Oh, fantastic. But it and I think, yeah, we obviously on this podcast we've covered whizzing round Europe and talking to all the European hunters, Australians, and I think we've been over to Canada as well. And it's just it's it's allowing people to have that insight into how the UK works and how the rest of the world works. And as you say, it needs to go for food, but we can't can't disregard what they do in South Africa because actually some of that that big game hunting, it's amazing. The it always comes across bad, I think, with the press, but when you actually boil it down, the uh the money that goes back into the community is pretty phenomenal.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, there's one I I don't want to dwell on it, but there's one uh company over there that I'm liaising with, and their whole story is around conservation, and they talk about how many animals they started with to how many more, and we're talking five, six, seven times more um purely because of the programme. Yeah. So, yes, people are paying to do it, but it you know, there are more animals because of it, yeah, and that has got to be a good thing.
SPEAKER_02But that never makes it out into the real world because it doesn't make sensational news that the press want to play with. And there's no way those guys are wasting that meat. No way. Oh no, no, no. 100%. Everything there is it goes back to the locals, the village, the whole animal is used.
SPEAKER_01But you know, for now, UK, I love it. I absolutely love going around the country. I've hopefully got my Chinese to shoot, uh I think November, and then Seeker. Just the Seeker. But Seeker, you've got to be fast, haven't you? I've I've told that. You're really quiet. Those are not those are not my uh my skills.
SPEAKER_02So if anybody sees Alex wandering about at like the stalking show gently, just placing his foot, he's practicing for a seeker hunt.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, well again, stalking show, what a great show. Absolutely. This is third year for us, fourth year for us, fourth year. Uh fourth year for go well, next year will be the fifth, won't it? Yeah, yeah. Again, like what a great show for bringing like-minded people together. Yeah, 100%.
SPEAKER_02It's one big social fast. Yeah, it's catching up with people, it's seeing people, it's talking to those traders that are all there that have the same interest. Yeah, it's it's an absolutely wonderful event. And so, yeah, uh, we will be there again. I'll probably be um like a limpet.
SPEAKER_01Tend to base yourself with me and then float like a butterfly.
Night Shooting And Thermal Mistakes
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I'm everywhere trying to deal with things. There are more plans this year for for different things at the stalking show, but uh it should be good. So uh yeah, it's it's a whole nother adventure. The film we've done this weekend, as I said, there's a there's a fair bit going on in there. There's definitely some interesting topics that we've gone through. Can we talk about it? As in the what we did, yeah.
SPEAKER_01Bit of night shooting.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, that was probably the biggest eye-opener for you. Yeah, uh something that Alex has never done, taking a thermal out. You uh you're working with some hic products, and obviously I'm I'm running Pulsar. Yeah, uh, but the whole thing about driving around forestry blocks on tracks with no lights and just looking out the window and making sure what you're spotting is actually it's amazing how many deer hide in the trees in the branches.
SPEAKER_01It it's that hot flash, and you suddenly stop.
SPEAKER_02Oh, it's alright, it's a bird. And and occasionally looks like a cat. So we'll we'll talk about this. I mean, that was that was scary. Actually, really, really interesting. We just come into this this new uh sort of uh plantation area, and I'd get a sudden stop, I've seen one, it's massive deer sat there, and I'm just like, well, where? I can't see it. So I I kind of looking out the window over Alex's shoulder, trying to get not too much heat off everything else, and he's like, I can see it, I can see it, it's a deer.
SPEAKER_01I would have absolutely swore blind that I was probably 20 to 30 meters from this huge deer.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, huge deer. Just sat there, not moving. So I get out the car, wander round, have a look, and you go, I think it's a a hare to start with. You're like, no, it's not a hare, it's definitely a deer.
SPEAKER_01It's deer like ears.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, and then obviously this thing does the classic, I'm gonna lick my paw, and it puts its obviously, Alex was looking at something else at this point, and this thing starts licking its paw, and I'm like, no, it's a cat, and it's four metres away from the car. So get the flashlight out, and he still can't see it until eventually it's like there it is.
SPEAKER_01Look, little tabby sat there, and uh it it really is it's taught me you uh at the moment I cannot trust myself in a thermal situation, not yet.
SPEAKER_02It it just goes to show that using thermal devices, how much um how much practice and knowledge the room for error is increased massively, isn't it? Yeah, so so anything working at night, it's a case of distances change, especially with a thermal because of the base magnifications. The the image you're looking at, whether there's something in front of it, behind it, to the side of it, you've got to take into account, and the whole Iden species identification and spending that time moving, as Alex will probably say, when I was looking for something, I wouldn't just look at it from the one position, I'd move to the left, I'd move to the right, really to try and make sure what we were looking at was actually our target. But um it's yeah, it was a good learning curve, a really good exercise in kind of showing you how it all works.
SPEAKER_01How complicated it can be.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, and and to be honest, it again for thermal use in Scotland or night vision, it is another whole new area for a lot of people up here because that legislation has only been in for about two years. Right. We you had to do all night shooting, the night license worked on three people. You'd have a driver, a lamp operator, and a shooter. Now they've changed it slightly that you can get away with two. You have to have a spotter and a shooter, and you can understand why you have to have a spotter because when you take that shot.
SPEAKER_01If you'd been on your own when I was watching, I mean I kept my eyes and thermal locked onto him.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah, 100%.
SPEAKER_01Whereas you've got, you know, you've got to regain everything.
SPEAKER_02Well, I'm trying to and that's why there's a topic in in the use of thermals, like especially on a thermal scope, using the the picture in picture, because actually that gives you you can have the zoomed in small section at the top, and then you've got the whole field of view. So if something does move, because any scope you're in tunnel vision. What happens when you shoot a deer in the daylight is you might lift your head off the scope and watch it move. And you can't do that, you can't do that in the dark. There's nothing there, is there? You take your head off the scope and you're confronted with black. And I think you've got video, you've got the camera rolling, and you just hear the shot, and we're just looking at darkness, yeah. But in the thermal, we're looking at hot detailed spots out there that we're trying to shoot. And trust me, shooting these bits of forestry in the dark is not something I want to do. I want to shoot them and clear them during the daylight hours, but it does become the point where the deer have learnt and it they only come out at night.
Range Work Mink Traps And Pheasants
SPEAKER_01So that was fun. Yeah, yeah. We did we did some uh 400 meter shooting.
SPEAKER_02We did, we took we've pushed it, I should say. We've pushed Alex to the next level from from shooting at 100 and 200 metres, he's now come all the way back to three and then to 400, striking a gun, no problem at all.
SPEAKER_01Again, terrifying what those rounds can do to seven mil steel. Yeah, absolutely terrifying. I've got some good footage of that, so head over to the video and watch that.
Wrap Up And Listener Feedback
SPEAKER_02So, yeah, moved the 308 up to a 165 grain RWS uh speed tip, and even I was shocked that it just at what range was that? 200? That was at 200, 2000, just drilled it, just drilled straight through it as if it wasn't there. Um they they were mild steel gongs. I'm not that I didn't take out the the hard ox. I was just more curious to see what would happen, and yeah, just absolutely phenomenal, really. But that was good fun, as I said. There's a good footage of that. And then we did a bit with the mink traps, bit of bit of minking. So um mink is an invasive species pretty much all over the place, but Scotland have a the invasive species organization that will basically lend you uh a mink trap and a raft, and we set them up, and hopefully there's a bit more in the film that explains about setting them up and putting them out and why we do it. It's been an amazing weekend. Have we done anything else? We went to the pheasants, my pheasants. Oh, yes, all your pheasants. So we had a look at all my pheasants and checked they were okay. They seem to be lots of driving round, lots of castles. Yeah, plenty of castles, a bit of sightseeing, and uh yeah, it's all it's just just a good weekend, really. So we're not gonna keep this too long. It was just a bit more of an update because I don't think I've ever really sat down and actually I've been the one that's actually interviewed Alex. I think the last time we had him on, it was we were catching up on a live, and that was we were just doing a down feed of of his trip to Scotland. So this is more of a bit of an insight as to what's going on. We're gonna probably pull it short now because we're about to pack him in into the truck and take him to the airport. Sweet. So thanks very much. Thank you. Hope you enjoyed that little insight into Alex's adventure. As I say, this was recorded some time ago, so everything he spoke about those films are all released now on the Hunter Gatherer YouTube channel. You may have already seen them if you follow the both of us. If you don't, go and have a look. So it's at that part of the podcast. You've listened to the whole episode, and hopefully you've got this far. If you have, I need your help and your feedback. Is there anything you would change with the way the podcast runs? Do you like the intro music? Don't you like the intro music? Please tell us who would you like us to talk to next? Would you like more topics on hunting? More topics on different things to do with the countryside. Should we go off down the rabbit hole and find something completely different to do? If you've got any ideas, catch us on social media, drop us a DM, Facebook, Instagram, or you can drop us an email, Pete at theoutdoorgibbon.com. Even just send us a letter if you really want to. Uh, but however, just get in touch with us and let us know what uh how you'd like the show to go. Without your feedback, I can't change it. And if I'm doing something wrong, it would be great to hear that. If I'm doing something right, just drop us an email or a message or something and just say, good job, keep it up. Every little helps, you know. It's always handy to uh to find out what what you want to hear. Catch you on the next one.